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THE BLOG--HISTORY

"Blue Oasis" began in 2005 in its Blogger format (now an archive) and became possibly the first Alaska Blog on Progressive Politics. At the 2008 Democratic National Convention, Celtic Diva's Blue Oasis was honored to represent Alaska as the state blog.

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In September 2008, Celtic Diva's Blue Oasis moved to a Soapblox Community Blog format. Readers can become full participants by registering on the blog to comment and write "diaries." Diary titles appear on the right sidebar for folks to read and provide comments. Blog editors may choose to move some of these diaries to the front page.

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YOUR BLOGMISTRESS

My name is Linda Kellen Biegel and I am a former 15-year Federal employee. Thirteen of those years were spent working for the US Army Corps of Engineers. I am also semi-retired from the Alaska music scene (singer, sound tech, stage manager, logistics).

When the blog was chosen to represent Alaska in the DNCC State Blogger Pool at the Denver Convention, I attended with the help of Alaska Real blogmistress, Writing Raven and my daughter Morrigan. On August 29th, one day after Barack Obama's inspiring speech at Invesco Field , my life took another turn as it did for all Alaska bloggers when Gov. Sarah Palin was chosen to be John McCain's VP running mate. Since then, I've either assisted or have been interviewed by media from the UK, Italy, Australia and Germany as well as national media outlets such as Wall Street Journal, NY Times, ABC Good Morning America's Kate Snow, National Journal, Dallas Morning News, LA Times, and NPR.

Presently, I work as a freelance writer, PR, event coordinator, community organizer, wife to computer programmer Josh and mother to 11-year-old Morrigan. Our family especially enjoys our summers in Alaska where we get to subsistence set-net fish Sockeye salmon as well as halibut fish/whalewatch in the family's homemade aluminum boat, "The Neverdone" (when it's working). We reside in Anchorage, Alaska.

Origin of "Celtic Diva"

I've used "Celtic Diva" as a screen name since the early 1990's on Web TV.

"Celtic"

"Folks have asked about my Celtic heritage, especially in light of my name. What they don't realize is that I'm adopted. I was born Valerie Morehead of the Clan Muirhead. I was adopted at three-months-old by the Kellens. I always "knew" I was Celt even before really knew. I was drawn to all things Scottish, especially music. That's why my parents eventually told me at age 16."

"Diva"

"Linda is well-known in Alaska & beyond as the prominent progressive political blogger Celtic Diva of Celtic Diva?s Blue Oasis. But back in the day, the early 1990s, I knew her as Linda Kellen, a member of the local folk/rock band Sky is Blu, which amongst other things performed in at least a couple or so of the annual women?s show Celebration of Change, in which I also performed. And if you don?t already know, let me tell you: Linda is one fine damn singer."

I went on after the break-up of "Sky is Blu" to perform with various Alaska musicians and work with national folks like Bo Diddly, Coco Montoya, Debbie Davies, Taj Mahal, The Fabulous Thunderbirds, Bad Company, Creedence Clearwater, Carny Wilson, etc...

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Why the "Trig Palin Conspiracy" is NOT the big story about his birth--guest post

by: Celtic Diva

Sat Jan 17, 2009 at 11:04:13 AM AKST



Lee Tompkins, BSN, is a labor and delivery nurse I met in September. She has been disturbed by the focus on the conspiracy and lack-of-focus on the medical implications of Governor Palin's fateful ride from Texas to Wasilla and subsequent birth of Trig in April 2007.

In light of the recent exploitation of that conspiracy by Palin herself, I am honored that Ms. Tomkins chose to write this article for our little blog.  You've never seen an article like this one before because this is the first time someone in the medical profession has chosen to speak of it publicly.

The Birth of a Conspiracy; Delivering the Real Issue

by Lee Tompkins, BSN

"Captive Alien Held in Area 51 by U.S. Military!"

"Elvis Is Alive!"

"U.S. Government Fakes Moon Landings!"

"Sarah Palin Fakes Pregnancy, Claims Daughter's Child as Her Own!"

All very sexy headlines and all conspiracy theories that some continue to believe to this day. Are any of them true? Who knows? What is more interesting is how and why such claims are picked up and seized by a segment of the American public. The first three are ones that I can't really comment on but the Sarah Palin one I can, having watched the story closely from the time the Anchorage Daily News reported the curious story of Trig Palin's birth last April, and having the requisite background in the medical field as a labor and delivery nurse as well as the necessary swiftness of foot and mind to avoid stepping in any BS in the field.

To some extent these stories are all crazes that took hold because people wanted to believe them. The world has been enchanted with the idea of space aliens all the way from a love affair with H.G. Wells to the Great Gazoo. The idea of E.T. being held captive in Roswell was one that our Star Trek-Star Wars-Lost in Space generation of baby boomers would latch onto with all the fierceness of a lassoed Bantha.  

Everybody loves Elvis. Who wouldn't want to see him alive and performing at the Sands in Vegas?  

The faked Apollo moon landing theory rocketed during a time in which Americans had a high degree of distrust in the government, who were either trying to draft you to go fight a war in a rice paddy or up to their usual dirty tricks breaking into the Watergate hotel. Would it really be a stretch that such a government would totally fabricate their proudest, most historic achievement?

Which bridges us to the case of Sarah Palin.

Let me say categorically that I think the widely disseminated rumor that Sarah Palin is not the mother of her child Trig is totally false, although I know many well-informed and well-educated people who believe otherwise, and I certainly understand their theory.

I'm going to spend some time discussing the reasons why I think the Palin faked pregnancy story is not true, but first I think it is of interest to comment on why this story has really caught hold of the imagination of many.  

Sarah Palin, after being thrust into the national consciousness as a Hail-Mary VP pass by McCain and the Republican Party, gave disastrous interviews with Charlie and Katie, which allowed the public begin to see the real unscripted Palin. All the while Troopergate was coming to head in Alaska, as well as other ethical issues dug up by a curious national news media. And a general consensus was formed about Sarah Palin by the public, and that consensus, held by all but her most ardent supporters, was that they disliked her. They saw her as phony, hypocritical and frightfully unprepared to be anywhere near the White House. She ended up with the highest negativity rating ever for any VP candidate, and an all-you-can-eat late night comedy feast.

So, the public loved Elvis and wanted to see him alive and there was a hopeful expectation that maybe he was still. And the general public disliked Sarah Palin and when the bizarre circumstances of the birth of her child Trig became generally known, the public wanted to believe that she was capable of faking a pregnancy in order to bolster her standing as a "family values" candidate by avoiding the baggage of a daughter who was about to become an unwed teenage mother. Avoiding that didn't quite work out for Palin as it turned out, but that didn't stop a vocal minority of conspiracy theorists to believe Palin capable of such chicanery earlier. The public wanted to believe the worst of Sarah Palin.

Which is kind of funny in a sad way when you think about it, because what the evidence very strongly suggests is that Palin was guilty of recklessly endangering the life of her unborn child, which to me is far worse than faking a pregnancy, to protect her political ambition and perhaps the reputation of her daughter. It's just not as sexy of a story, not one the public could latch onto with such fervor. Discussing ruptured membranes ain't exactly something to talk about at the dinner table. And since "life imitates art more than art imitates life" it's highly doubtful the Desperate Housewives' writers will be opening next season with one of the wives flying transcontinentally with preterm premature rupture of membranes.

(much, MUCH more below the fold)

Celtic Diva :: Why the "Trig Palin Conspiracy" is NOT the big story about his birth--guest post


The public couldn't understand why anyone would do anything other than take the greatest of care and every absolute precaution with the health of a special needs child, whose parent should have been their greatest advocate and protector.

The faked pregnancy theory was easier to believe. And so it was born.

But with birth eventually comes death, and so the conspiracy that was born should now be allowed to die so that the real issue can come to light: the questionable judgment of Sarah Palin, and the local news media's inadequate coverage which put the public it serves at risk.

A couple of Google searches and it's not difficult to figure out that the likelihood of a Down's pregnancy in a 44-year old woman is 25 times greater than that of a teenager. Of course, overall more Down's babies are born in the younger age groups but that is reflective of the greater numbers of pregnancies occurring in younger women than older women. That statistic alone should be convincing enough, but it is probably not.

Certainly looks can be deceiving, but Palin looked pregnant, as I noticed and questioned whether she was pregnant after seeing a photo of her on the ADN website several days before she announced she was expecting. And after delivery she appeared to carry the appropriate postpartum weight you would expect to see. As mothers we've all been there.

The argument against a conspiracy that bothers me most personally is this: the very idea that doctors or nurses would involve themselves willingly in a cover-up is absurd, and quite frankly, insulting. If while working I was asked to aid and abet an unethical activity I would have promptly turned in my badge and walked out. Reviewing this supposed scenario over and over I just don't see how this could have happened at any reputable medical facility.

If you are one that still believes Elvis is alive then it is doubtful I've convinced you that Palin is Trig's mom. I agree, it would be easy for Palin to refute the claim by providing Trig's birth certificate and/or photos of her immediately after delivery, looking tired and disheveled, just as I did, holding her precious new gift. Why she has yet to do so I haven't a clue. Does she enjoy the attention this controversy receives? I can't answer that. All I do know is that if someone questioned whether one of my kids was my own it would take me all of five minutes to prove it.

In a strange way I'd almost rather be writing about a faked pregnancy than what really happened and was reported on in the April 22nd issue of the ADN by reporter Lisa Demer as well as a KTUU evening news cast that interviewed Palin's father, Chuck Heath. Contrary to Demer's page A-7 headline, Palin did put Trig at risk by wanting an Alaska birth.

    o    During that KTUU interview Health proclaimed his daughter's water broke in Texas but that she managed to avoid delivery until she returned to Alaska. To a labor and delivery nurse's ears, this was the equivalent of nails running down a chalkboard.

"She did what?? Is this really true, if so, what the hell was she thinking?? Why did her doctor allow her to do this??"

It wasn't until Demer's article appeared a couple of days later that some of my questions were answered, but were answered in such a manner that left me with more questions: questions of Palin's judgment. If you can't make good choices and decisions during the most critical time of one's life, can you or should you be trusted to make decisions at less critical times or for others??

    o   Palin chose to fly to Texas for a Governor's conference at 35 weeks of pregnancy. Why she chose to go instead of sending a surrogate is unknown and unreported. According to the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists late pregnancy air travel poses an increased risk of preterm labor and other complications such as premature rupture of membranes (leaking amniotic fluid). And the Governor, having already known Trig was a Down syndrome child, knew this was a higher than average risk pregnancy, since Down's children often have additional congenital problems such as cardiac issues.

    o   Palin's water broke at 4:00 am Texas time and at that time was having contractions that were "different" than contractions she had previously, she informed her Alaska family physician Dr. Cathy Baldwin-Johnson. Palin reportedly told her physician she would be staying to deliver a luncheon address, one she was "determined to give."

The exact nature of any advice given by Dr. Baldwin-Johnson to Palin in these conversations is unclear and unreported. The very limited reporting here includes that Palin was having contractions, but "did not ask for a medical OK to fly." Whether she was advised to seek medical care with one of the hundreds of OB doctors and several well-equipped OB facilities in Dallas is unreported. Whether the risks of traveling with an undiagnosed complication of pregnancy in a high risk situation were discussed with Palin is unreported. Whether advice was given that it was absolutely safe to travel back or that the doctor advised her to return without a hands-on medical evaluation is unreported.

Any doctor who was at all prudent would have insisted that Palin be evaluated hands-on in Dallas, with appropriate fetal monitoring and verification of membrane status. Any mother who was at all prudent and interested in doing everything she could to protect the life of her unborn child would follow that advice and would have asked her doctor whether it was safe to fly, i.e. asked for a medical OK to fly. What would be the point of any conversations between Palin and her doctor if these incredibly important issues weren't asked and addressed? Physicians cannot diagnose over the phone. (Hopefully Palin didn't call to discuss the weather). We do know that if advice to be seen locally was given or that the risks of traveling long distances by air were discussed with the Governor, that advice and those risks were ignored by Palin.

The reason Palin made this decision is unclear. Todd Palin is quoted as saying "You can't have a fish picker from Texas", indicating that he found the possibility of Trig being born in Texas distasteful. Whether Todd Palin coerced the Governor to avoid medical care in Texas and return to Alaska is uncertain and unreported. What is true is that any woman presenting to an OB facility in Texas with ruptured membranes would not have been allowed to travel by air and would have required Palin to sign out Against Medical Advice (AMA) had she expressed an intent in flying back to Alaska to deliver. An AMA for a government leader would look very bad.

    o   Having given her speech, Palin caught an earlier flight out of Dallas, a fact previously unreported. At the airport she did not inform the flight personnel that she was pregnant and was suffering a complication of pregnancy, thereby putting the entire flight at risk for diversion should further problems or delivery become eminent. Airliners are woefully inadequately prepared for medical emergencies and lack any proper equipment necessary to resuscitate a newborn. Even a 35-week fetus may have immature lung development.

    o   Upon arrival to Alaska 11 hours later, she and her husband drove to Matsu-Regional Hospital in Palmer, a drive that usually takes at least an hour, rather than going to a larger facility in Anchorage, which was no more than 15 minutes from the airport and the only facility in the state with a Level III NICU. The reason for that is unknown and unreported. It is reported that the delivery had to be induced at Mat-Su Regional and the baby was delivered at 6:30 a.m.

Many who believe in the conspiracy theory cannot understand how a multiparous woman could manage to fly with preterm premature rupture of membranes for such an extended period of time without delivering. I wouldn't have made it with my rapid 2nd labor, so I can't answer that question. It simply isn't something I would have ever contemplated.

The notion that Palin had to be induced therefore she wasn't really is labor is grossly misunderstood by the general public. Inductions are NEVER done on a preterm pregnancy unless there is a known complication or problem with the fetus. If the governor had arrived at the hospital with ruptured membranes but without other complications, more than likely her family physician would have waited until the morning to begin induction, a usual routine at busy OB facilities. The fact that the governor's induction began in the middle of the night is strongly indicative that significant problems were occurring that warranted immediate attention, problems such as fetal distress or infection due to the extended time period of ruptured membranes.

The bottom line: Why Governor Palin chose to give a speech over seeking appropriate care for her unborn child is known only to Governor Palin, but her actions speak volumes to those of us listening, and listening carefully.

In my opinion I believe Governor Palin's actions indicated she knowingly and recklessly endangered the life of her unborn child. She is incredibly fortunate that the outcome was ultimately positive, but someone else may not be so lucky, hence the failure of the local news media to do it's job to properly report and to warn others that Governor Palin's choices were not the wisest.

So why didn't they? A few possible answers:

    1.   Sensitivity to the governor during a difficult time giving birth to a baby that will require life-long intensive therapy if it is to achieve an IQ score higher than the Down's average of 40. That's fair enough.

    2.   Governor Palin sells newspapers to a segment of the population the news paper is targeting: females. We all know we shouldn't bite the hand that feeds us.

    3.   Popularity. Governor Palin's approval ratings were high at the time and the news paper supported the governor's position on various political issues such as increased oil taxation, etc.

Sarah Palin was lucky, Sarah Smith or Sarah Jones may not be. The ADN failed in it's obligation to the public it serves to fully inform and educate on potential public health and safety issues. The accolades the governor received for being a "tough Alaskan woman" may prove deadly for someone imitating her actions. Popularity trumped common sense and good sound journalism. Regardless of the sensitivity issue the ADN, even at a later date, should have yet failed to inform the public that the governor's actions were wrong, and dangerous.

Because of this failure I believe the ADN is partially culpable for this whole conspiracy theory. If they had done their job right to begin with, the details of the birth would have been more clear and this nonsense about faked pregnancy would have been supplanted by the clear realization that Palin risked the life of her unborn child, took absolutely no prudent precautions for reasons one cannot even imagine, all to avoid having a fish picker born in Texas.

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Trig needs a real mommy (4.00 / 3)
It is apparent to me that Sarah has low expectations for little Trig.  She wasn't careful about his delivery because she didn't really care if he died.  She totes him around like a stuffed animal.  Hauling him around the country for three months showed little regard for his medical needs or safety.  She will probably never seek the kind of care and educational opportunities that he will need to succeed.      She has clearly demonstrated that her political ambition trumps the needs of her children.  Or perhaps I should say that TODD's political ambition trumps the family since he is obviously calling the shots and she is his sexy sock puppet.

It's hard to grasp. . . (0.00 / 0)
that the guv would do everything she did. She endangered herself, the life of her child, the flights and schedules of people trying to get home to loved ones or to vacations, children getting to see parents in divorces, flight attendants wanting to get off their shift-- this is pathetically normal for Palin, centered only on herself. She's all about #1.

Had Palin had bad things happen on the trip, it would all be more publicity for her, so she would win either way. She could have sued her doctor for giving advice over the phone. Anything other than, "Getcherarse to the hospital NOW." and calling the ambulance for the governor was irresponsible of Baldwin-Johnson.

I prefer the conspiracy theory to the reality of what Lee has presented.

Why was the guv so intent on giving a speech, yet being home for educational conferences is low on her priorities when Saxby needed her?

I don't click on stories of the guv at ADN-- I won't read about her. I do not like Snowmobile Barbie any more.  


[ Parent ]
I must say... (3.00 / 2)
...and I'm sorry to say this, but I'm not terribly impressed with your guest post, Lee Thompkins, BSN.

You've just rehashed very VERY old ground, and in my opinion brought nothing new to the table.  

We who have been contemplating Sarah Palin's so-called alleged August 2007-April 2008 pregnancy have very thoroughly discussed every one of the aspects you've discussed above.

I'm just guessing that your credentials allowed you to only consider the narrow framework you discussed.

Some of us "conspiracy theorists" accept all of what you've said (and again, you have not illuminated the topic, or brought forth a new scenario), some of us accept part of what you've said, and some of us obviously have gone in a different direction.  And from what I can see, we have unearthed a lot more information than you have.  

P.S.  I am a bit offended by your term "sexy" when you discuss the story "not being one the public could latch onto with such fervor."  That term sullies and diminishes the critical and intelligent work being done to investigate Sarah Palin's deceptions.



KayJay, in her defense... (3.00 / 1)
...I believe that she completely respects (as do I) many of the folks who do lean towards questioning the legitimacy of the birth because, quite frankly, the Palins have purposely surrounded the entire event with a shroud of secrecy.

However, I DO NOT believe you have seen such a thorough medical analysis of the inappropriateness and danger of the actions SHE ACTUALLY CLAIMED she took!  As a matter-of-fact, that particular issue is what has frustrated the heck out of me over these months.


Celtic Diva


[ Parent ]
Well, actually I have, Linda... (0.00 / 0)
I've never actually worked for an OB-Gyn, but I have worked with just about every medical specialist there is.  I also worked in med. records in a hospital for many years and seen/handled records of some pretty s.t.r.a.n.g.e.  situations.  Even brought them to court in some cases in answer to subpoena duces tecum.

I recognize each and every one of the narrow-focus phases Ms. Thompkins outlined above, of the Sarah Palin "wild ride" subsequent to the alleged ruptured membranes, that altogether they compound a simple situation into an amazingly selfish and life-threatening one -- that, for a high-profile public figure, is beyond logic.

So, yes, I recognize Ms. Thompkins' medical analysis, I'm just saying she shut the door on other theories about SP's motivation, plan, and execution.

 



[ Parent ]
Help me to understand... (0.00 / 0)
According to your comment you have never worked with OB/GYN's but you do have experience in medical records. Am I correct in assuming you do not have experience working directly with patients? No one will argue that the medical records department plays an important role in the management of health care. However, it's not the same as being on the front lines.

As an experienced L&D nurse, including my years as an Air Force officer, I been covered in blood many times, frantically trying to help save the life of a pregnant woman bleeding to death. I've had the unfortunate experience of watching a fetal heart rate drop to near zero as we're racing against the clock to save the baby via an emergent c-section. I've held the hands of women who were on the verge of breakdown when a fetal heart rate can't be found, and the subsequent ultrasound that shows a non-beating heart.

You can't get that feeling from the pages of a medical record.

I understand you are invested emotionally in the conspiracy cover-up. You are entitled to your opinions. I examined this situation carefully through the eyes of someone who has been there both as a professional and as a mother.

I spoke off record with several OB/GYN's and all agreed they DO NOT believe the conspiracy theory. Having worked in L&D units there is NO WAY a faked pregnancy and delivery could have happened, except on a Hollywood set. My own personal OB/GYN, who dislikes Palin immensely, doesn't buy the conspiracy either.

I'm sorry that you fail to understand that faking a pregnancy, though it requires a high degree of abnormal thinking, if far far better than what Palin did. No one dies as a direct result of a faked pregnancy. Both Palin and her son could have died as a direct result of her egregious actions.


[ Parent ]
I hope you don't think... (0.00 / 0)
from what I wrote before that I base all my experience on what I read in the medical records that have passed through my hands between 1966-1990 and 2003-2006.

I mentioned that I have worked for many physicians, and as an assistant administrator of medical records (the old term for what is now called assistant director of health information services), I worked WITH every physician in our 350+ bed hospital in organizing medical staff meetings that required our services, and many other duties that involved conferences with physicians.  

We didn't always discuss specific medical records.  We discussed information that to this day remains confidential regarding patient crises and problems that affected both the physicians and the hospital -- my employment pre-dates HIPAA by 6 years minimum, much to my chagrin, but I've been well versed in what I can talk about and what I cannot.

Also, I moved from that position (thanks to an abiding disgust for hospital politics) to serving as an independent contractor to 15 individual and different specialists and one large group as a medical word processor (used to be called medical transcriptionist, now called medical health information specialist).  I worked in that capacity for another 12 years, as well as on-call service as office receptionist for several physicians (some people called it a "come-down", but I enjoyed the change).

In a similar situation one would have to be truly a dolt not to absorb everything about a physician's practice except the actual hands-on experience.

My sister is the nurse in the family.  She's the one who's been a staff nurse, a head nurse, a supervisor, an ICU nurse, an Emergency nurse, a surgical nurse, a medical record department director, a director of staff support and quality assurance and discharge planning over 35 years in the same hospital the size of the Mat-Su Reg.Med.Ctr...and is now full circle, a staff nurse in an oncology day care center.

So, no, I have never had blood on my hands, but I can discuss with considerable experience some rather esoteric subjects with both my sister and any physician I've ever come in contact with.

---------------------------

On the contrary, I do understand that IF Sarah Palin was truly pregnant and did what she says she did in the several weeks preceding the "wild ride" (the several long trips to the lower-48) and the "wild ride" and its immediate sequel thereafter, it's MUCH worse than faking a pregnancy.

That's one of the main reasons I'd like to believe she faked the pregnancy.  It's quite a bit more benign a scenario than attempting a "fundamentalist abortion"; and it would be more charitable of me, as someone who doesn't know the woman, to believe she's not so crazy as to attempt what you suggest.

So, yeah, I'll stick with the "conspiracy cover-up" scenario.  Even an apparent nitwit like Sarah Palin deserves a little benefit of the doubt.



[ Parent ]
Of course not.... (0.00 / 0)
We all absorb information that we see, hear, and read, but that doesn't equate to HIPAA violations.

I give you much credit for your work as a transcriptionist- not an easy one at all. You really have to know your stuff.

I'm past believing that Palin "deserves a little benefit of the doubt." I live in Alaska and have seen/heard enough of her shenanigans. Once you've had enough exposure to her you realize that the reckless endangerment is not out of the realm of possibility.

Besides, if she comes forward with proof then all of this goes by the wayside, and it shouldn't. All she has to do is say, "Here's the proof, now leave Trig alone." We can't weaken our argument by allowing her to play offense.


[ Parent ]
I guess while we're having this dialogue, you and I.... (0.00 / 0)
....I should ask you one question that I don't think you covered in your original posting, with my additional commentary:

What is your theory -- or do you have one? -- as to how Sarah Palin managed to get checked in and embark on the flight from Dallas to Seattle, get seated and fasten her seatbelt, and fly for 4 hours without someone noticing her 8-month protruding belly?  Or, how, after a several hour layover in Seattle, she managed to do this AGAIN, and AGAIN no one noticed her protruding belly?

I'm not talking about just the cabin attendants -- there's attendants staffing the check-in and the lounge (which I assume she had access to) -- you'd think they would have noticed her belly.  Presumably those cabin attendants knew the Governor of the state their flagship airline flys in and out of daily was on their two flights with her small retinue, which we know included the ever-present Todd, maybe her assistant too.

Yes, I know that airline attendants rotate flights and not ALL of them have their fingers on the daily news out of Anchorage.  But she wasn't traveling under an alias, and presumably she did the meet-and-greet with the attendants and perhaps even one of the pilots.

You'd think one of them would have connected the dots:  Governor Palin + announcement in early March that she was 7 months pregnant = she's 8 months pregnant NOW, what's she doing flying?????



[ Parent ]
Simple... (0.00 / 0)
Alaska Airlines has an incredibly vague pregnancy travel policy. Due to privacy and discrimination issues they can't ask if a woman is pregnant.

We actively tried to have that changed but the CEO of Alaska Airlines informed us personally that it wouldn't be changed.

Here's the exact quote from Alaska Airlines:
"We do not have any restrictions or specifications for women traveling when pregnant. However, we do suggest consulting a physician prior to any air travel."


[ Parent ]
They shouldn't have had to ASK a public figure... (4.00 / 1)
...like Governor Palin.  She's not just some anonymous woman they've never seen before, and would have no way of knowing if a large belly is a cancerous tumor or a pregnancy.  No need to invoke those privacy-and-discrimination-issues which prevent the gaucherie of asking (how awful it'd be if it were the former, and to be asked if it were the latter -- no doubt a major reason for the vague policy).

I hope it's not presumptuous of me to assume they knew who she was.

Me?  I'm pretty rotund, myself, and if I were 30 years younger I could see being asked... :)

Which reminds me, it's AWFULLY difficult to fasten one of those airline seatbelts around your hips unless you're pretty slim, like most men are around the hips, and most slender non-pregnant women.  We "mature figured" women struggle a bit.  I don't think the total length of the seatbelt is more than a yard long.

I believe, from pictures I've seen of slender young pregnant women in their 8th month -- we've had links to representative pictures over at palindeception.com -- the pregnant uterus bulges out quite markedly over the pubic bone, and would cause some seat-belt-fastening difficulty.

If Sarah Palin was wearing her long dark jacket or some other disguising jacket onto the plane and in her seat, and attempted to fasten her seatbelt around the jacket AND her large belly, wouldn't she have had to ask for one of those seatbelt extensions?

(unless she's like me, and has one of her own)



[ Parent ]
Nail Meet Hammer (3.75 / 4)
I think she has hit the nail on the head.

I was trying to explain this to a friend of mine the other day, and I started back a little farther. I went back to the amnio, because I don't think you can exclude that from the entire process either.

No one, and I am saying no one, including Palin herself has ever explained why a Pro-lifer would have an amnio.

I have thought about it and finally came up with my only rational explanation. Palin had become a Pro-abortion Pro-Lifer.

She really didn't want this baby, she had the amnio, found out then the baby was "damaged" and really realized she didn't want it...then denied she was even pregnant for months, until she could deny it no longer, so had to own up to it. Then, in Texas realizing she had a serious problem, made a fateful decision to travel as she did, in the hopes that God would take over and she wouldn't have the baby. Cynical?? Yes, maybe I am...but it all fits in with your explanation, and it all fits in with what happened and it explains the reasoning behind her actions.

She doesn't care about others, we all know that, so the others on the plane, the flight crew, they meant nothing to her, it didn't matter if she inconvenienced them. It has always been and always will be about Sarah, and Todd to a certain extent.

The kids are an afterthought and only a prop and a way to make her look better. Just as she used them in the campaign, she uses them in her day to day life.

Look at her references, Hockey MOM, Wal-Mart MOM, and on and on...she uses the kids to further her career and her agenda.

Just my thoughts...but it goes along with what Lee is saying...just maybe an explanation for the reasoning behind it.  


ITA (4.00 / 1)
  I totally agree.  Further evidence of her complete disregard for Trig's well-being is that little Piper appears to be his primary caretaker during the photo-ops. Little Trig should go live with his grandparents or a foster family who can love him and help him reach his full potential.  In Sarah and Todd's care he will always be regarded as an unfortunate accident.

[ Parent ]
Very good points. (4.00 / 1)
I intentionally avoided the abortion issue since it is such a heated topic and presented a slight detour to the point I was trying to make: the reckless endangerment.

However, a few weeks ago I had a discussion with a woman very involved in the right-to-life movement and pro-Palin, obviously.

The questions I posed to this woman regarding Palin and her return flight from Dallas were: "Does a 35-week fetus not deserve the same fetal rights as an 8-week fetus?? Should a 35-week fetus have access to appropriate medical care?"

I must admit it was painful watching her squirm since she knew where I was going with those questions. You guessed it, she couldn't answer them without damning Palin to a degree.

Interestingly, she did admit that a "purist" would not have had an amnio, since the belief is you take whatever God gives you.

An interesting angle for another piece.


[ Parent ]
Amnio (4.00 / 1)
Now, don't get me wrong here, I'm not coming to Palin's defense, but having an amnio can help a mother and her physician know if the baby will need special care immediately after delivery, right? I may be wrong, but isn't there a good chance that a baby with DS would need heart surgery after birth? So you'd want to know in order to deliver in a hospital equipped to handle such surgery. Am I totally off target here?

I don't know if she faked her pregnancy, or if she is just grossly negligent when it comes to the care of her children, but something is not right with that woman.  


[ Parent ]
No, you are not off target. (0.00 / 0)
However, an amnio will only tell you the presence of a genetic abnormality, such as Down's, but not any specific details. A high-level ultrasound can be used to determine if a cardiac abnormality is present.

At her advanced age I don't think an amnio was unreasonable. However, if you think about the timing of an amnio it is usually done so that the mother can utilize the information to determine if she will continue with the pregnancy. It is likely that Palin would have figured out eventually, even without an amnio, that she was carrying a Down's child, since there are measurements and characteristics noted on ultrasound.


[ Parent ]
Amnios have risks and can be inaccurate (4.00 / 1)
I am not a medical professional. I simply researched just about everything when I was 40 and pregnant because I was having some problems and was afraid for my baby. She's 4 years old and quite healthy by the way. Here is what I found: There is a small chance that after an amnio is performed, fluid can continue to leak out causing a miscarriage. Also, my OB tried to get me to get one and I wouldn't because of that risk I just described, the prenatal specialist he referred me to also performed monthly level 2 ultrasounds so I went with that. I also had already decided to have her regardless of her condition. BUT HERE'S THE KICKER that made my stomach sick: per my OB nurse, there were other prenatal specialist in our area that she no longer referred patients to because they recommended pregnancy termination to those patients based on an amnio stating the unborn babies had defects. BUT GUESS WHAT? A great majority of those babies were born normal THE AMNIOS WERE WRONG. So, I am not a huge fan.

[ Parent ]
Amnio (0.00 / 0)
You are right, that could be a good reason to have an amnio, in order to prepare if there were complications. That said, if that was Palin's reason, then she is doubly at fault for ignoring the fact that she was carrying a high risk infant.  

[ Parent ]
all theories leave Palin looking like a douchebag (4.00 / 2)
While I enjoy "believing" the fake pregnancy theory, I have always leaned toward the "irresponsible egomaniac" theory. I am pleased to see some new info I hadn't seen before, particularly about Todd's possible part in the whole thing. Todd strikes me as a man who is at least as sociopathic as his wife, and his ignorant "fish picker from Texas" comment sounds just like him.
And I agree that the Alaska mainstream media has been negligent PERIOD concerning Palin and everything she has done, most specifically ADN.
Thanks for the detailed rundown on the nasty person who is the Alaska governor. And I feel so sorry for little Trig, who will probably never reach the potential he would in a truly loving, intelligent family. So sad.  

Character Flaws or Something Deeper? (0.00 / 0)
Palin and all associated with her was guilty of recklessly endangering the life of her unborn child. Dr. Thompkins, thank you for your expert opinion. I appreciate you reminding us so eloquently it was all to avoid having a fish picker born in Texas.  

What this is! (0.00 / 0)
What's a fish picker?

[ Parent ]
I am assuming a fish picker... (0.00 / 0)
is someone who picks fish out of dip nets or at a fish processing plant.

[ Parent ]
Dang, Lee, you beat me to it... (0.00 / 0)
...that was a question I could actually answer!!!!


Celtic Diva


[ Parent ]
hmph (0.00 / 0)
They want Trig to do that? High aspirations, huh?

[ Parent ]
The Palins have a commercial fishing business. (4.00 / 3)
However, interestingly, Piper was caught on tape, when asked by her mother what she wanted to be when she grows up, Piper replied: "a babysitter."

Palin looked mortified with that response.  


[ Parent ]
Thank you! (0.00 / 0)
BTW: I am not a physician, and I don't play one on TV either ;)

[ Parent ]
Still quite informed (0.00 / 0)
My mistake about being a doc. You would be good on tv  ;)

[ Parent ]
Go easy on the Nurse. She brings credibility.... (4.00 / 1)
especially at a time when Alaska's Imelda Marcos is trying to discredit bloggers. This intelligent nurse has stuck her neck out BIG TIME professionally and personally by taking the time to write such detailed accounts backed up with CREDIBLE medical facts. As far as the rehashing and redundancy she has been accused of, I BEG TO DIFFER. I didn't know all that and MORE IMPORTANTLY before I read this, I privately felt that "talk" of Palin putting her baby at risk was unfair speculation UNTIL NOW. Thank you, Nurse and of course, Miss Diva.

Help me out here. I thought that airlines did not allow third trimester women to fly. Am I wrong?



Airline policies vary... (0.00 / 0)
Alaska Airlines has a very vague pregnancy travel policy in place, one that my husband and I actively tried to have changed by contacting the CEO of Alaska Airlines directly.

They advised us that due to "privacy and discrimination issues" they cannot refuse or even ask if a woman is pregnant.

Other airlines have stricter policies.

My personal OB/GYN doesn't ok air travel after 28-weeks gestation. I asked what would be said to me if I called from Texas at 4:00 am saying my water broke and the reply was: "Congratulations, but I won't be the one delivering your baby, someone in Texas will. Now get to the hospital."  


[ Parent ]
A Solution? (0.00 / 0)
Airlines need to ask people if they are pregnant or have medical conditions that may cause them problems. If airplanes have to be turned around, then the passenger had beet hope they have a way to compensate everyone for what they cause.

[ Parent ]
I don't disagree... (4.00 / 1)
I found the response from Alaska Airlines surprising, since my letter questioned who would be held liable if a jet could not land fast enough to get medical care in an emergency. I'm not an attorney, but apparently the likelihood of being sued for invasion of privacy is a stronger issue than medical emergencies mid-air.

Bear in mind that pregnancy is different than say, someone with a cardiac history. Pregnancy is finite, but a person may not know if/when a heart attack will strike unless they are having active chest pains while boarding.

I would not be happy if I was flying to a funeral, etc. and my plane had to be diverted because of a foolish person willing to travel so late in pregnancy.

Again, my personal OB/GYN doesn't approve travel after 28 weeks. ACOG states air travel in late pregnancy should be avoided.


[ Parent ]
ITA-- (0.00 / 0)
Some one very, very close to me died shortly after I got off a plane. This person was holding on (very painful) so I could get there and say good bye. The personal attendants where telling this person where I was, how many hours I'd be, when my plane landed, I kept calling and saying which major cross roads I was at and it was being relayed to this person. Had some bubbleheaded governor caused me to miss that with something so easy to solve, I'd have been pissed. Maybe found a way to sue. A heart attack-- I'd have not been angry and indeed prayed for the person. Can't have a fish picker from Texas? What about "Can't have a child miss saying good buy to a parent!"

Thank you for this article, Lee.

You have shed more light on this situation than anyone and the guv should not be criticizing the press but on her knees thanking them for having been so kind to her.  


[ Parent ]
Palin (4.00 / 3)
I am a nurse also and these were the exact thoughts I had when I read about this birth. Palin risked her life, the life of her baby and everyone on that airplane. NO medical professional would have advised her to get on the plane with ruptured membranes with a known Down's child, or any other child. She apparently doesn't "choose" to avoid pregnancy, but she has no intention of letting her children inconvenience her, even before they are born(certainly not afterwards!). I don't know whether this is grossly poor judgement, or she is just so self-centered that only her desires are important. I totally agree that the ADN should have made it clear that this was an extremely risky thing she did, and could have turned out tragically.

Lee Thompkins is forgetting Palin's religion (0.00 / 0)
A) Palin's church (the one where she was blessed by the crazy witch hunter) believes that sin and geography are related, and that Mat-Su will be a haven for evangelicals in the end times.

B) Palin risks her child to have it born in Mat-Su.

Hmm gee I wonder if A and B are related do you think?


Mat-su (0.00 / 0)
Is this why she also refuses to go to Juneau to do her job?

[ Parent ]
google spiritual mapping (0.00 / 0)
Indeed.  Certified Pentecostal spiritual mappers have determined that Juneau is a godless decadent cesspool governed by demonic spirits.  The fact that she won't move to Juneau is actually a sign of benevolent parenting because she doesn't want her children possessed by evil spirits.

[ Parent ]
I am also a BSN (4.00 / 4)
who only has L&D experience from my clinicals about a hundred years ago.  I went from cardiology to emergency medicine and became completely involved in prehospital medicine.  I have caught 27 babies, out of the hospital and in emergency labor settings.  I am in complete agreement with Lee's assessment.  In my own opinion, a 44 year old woman, multip, with a predetermined diagnosis of a baby with Down syndrome should definitely be classified as a high-risk pregnancy.  I've tossed around the conspiracy theory in my mind - and yes, it could be real, but I am much more in agreement with Lee.  I may even feel stronger about Palin's egotistical need to be seen and heard as a 'powerful new conservative' which is why the Texas speech trumped medical care.  The statement about a fish picker not being born in Texas shows even less regard for that baby's health.  It shouldn't have mattered one bit where he was born, what should have been important is that he was born healthy in a place that could provide any necessary critical care to a preemie with Down's.  It just proves to me that she cares much more about herself than her children, her maternal instinct, her constituents, well-hell, she cares about herself above all else.  This is a pathological defect.
From my own experience, it is awful to be on the catching side of an emergency delivery with a lot of unknowns.  I find her actions negligent in all ways.

Dr. Baldwin-Johnson (0.00 / 0)
Excellent post Ms Lee Thompkins. Even conspiracy believers must question why Palin's doctor was not interviewed about the ricks to the baby by Palin's flight back home. There really was a chance of a painful death to baby Trig while on an aircraft traveling to Alaska.

So many questions. The spotlight needs to focus on Dr. Baldwin-Johnson right now.

 


Shut Down (4.00 / 2)
Another victim of silence. . . prevention of unwanted pregnancy by methods other than abortion.  Since Palin shut down any discussion of Bristol's pregnancy, the media did not discuss the failure of abstinence only sex education. I AM EVERY WOMAN.  I am pro-life and pro-choice. Let the discussion begin.

[ Parent ]
Racism may be part of the puzzle (0.00 / 0)
I believe that Todd in particular is overtly racist.  Delivery in Texas carried a much higher risk of Sarah being cared for by African-American or Hispanic providers.  I'm guessing that Mat-Su has a less diverse population than Anchorage as well.

I'm not saying he's not racist (3.50 / 2)
but I doubt that is why he didn't want Trig born in Texas.

There's been a rivalry between Texas and Alaska for awhile now but especially since the construction of the pipeline in the 70s.  It has to do with the Texas oil men coming up here and basically running things.

If you work in Prudhoe Bay, it's easy to develop an EXTREME distaste for Texans, as the oil companies usually bring a lot of them in to work up there.  The work is shift work so you are 2 weeks on 2 weeks off, or some such combination.  A lot of the out of state people make their money then take it home with them and Alaska doesn't see a dime.

And seriously, some of these people won't shut up about how WONDERFUL Texas is.


Celtic Diva


[ Parent ]
Texa-phobia (0.00 / 0)

Interesting.  That isn't something I would have thought of, being on the east coast.

But I do think they are racist...but that's another thread.


[ Parent ]
Much has been made of Todd Palin... (4.00 / 1)
....being part Yupik, particularly in discussions on various blogs about the needs of AK natives and the native villages, and the Native Corporations (see the cynical POVs on the ADN topic about Emmonak).

Just from appearance alone, he doesn't appear to have Yupik ancestry -- how much is it, 1/4, or 1/8th?  Blue eyes?  The Scandahoovian in him must have wrassled with the Yupik, and won.  (just kidding)

Some of the lower-48 folks don't understand why he doesn't champion the causes of the Native population, at least more publicly.   Or why Sarah Palin doesn't honor his ancestry by putting Native concerns near the top of her priority list.



[ Parent ]
Todd is 1/8 Native (4.00 / 1)
I am 1/4 Native, so neener to him, and he is a racist and a sociopath.

[ Parent ]
With due respect and appreciation ... (4.00 / 1)
... to the guest poster.  You are quite right, if Governor Palin was pregnant with Trig and did give birth to him according to the official story, she either had a death wish for this infant or she was totally, dangerously wrong in the actions she took.

Perhaps you are not aware, however, that there is no verifiable information that she was pregnant in 2007-2008.  Perhaps you are simply not aware that there are many pieces of information that contradict and put the lie to her claim that she was indeed pregnant with Trig.

In the absence of any data that goes to prove she was pregnant, and in the face of significant data that tends to strongly contradict that story, I believe your story is good for one reason only -- to smoke out the doctor who must have approved of such a wild ride.

I seriously doubt any medical professional would have done so, yet if we are to believe Governor Palin's story, we have to swallow that someone (perhaps Dr. Cathy Baldwin-Johnson) failed to provide critical warnings and advice to Governor Palin who reportedly was leaking amniotic fluid and experiencing contractions before she gave her address to the Texas energy producers.  No MD would be so blase.  No MD would be so careless.  No MD would risk their license by neglecting to strongly urge a patient like Governor Palin to get to the nearest hospital for a checkup.  

Someone else mentioned, and I hope you check it out -- that the Mat-Su hospital had been taken over by a religious sect. In the name of a greater good (7 mountains) I consider it quite possible that a doctor and an assistant may have facilitated Governor Palin's big fib about who had the baby.  Until and unless Dr. Cathy Baldwin-Johnson speaks in her own voice, we may not know what really happened.


Ennealogic???? (0.00 / 0)
Perhaps you are not aware, however, that there is no verifiable information that she was pregnant in 2007-2008.  Perhaps you are simply not aware that there are many pieces of information that contradict and put the lie to her claim that she was indeed pregnant with Trig.

In the absence of any data that goes to prove she was pregnant, and in the face of significant data that tends to strongly contradict that story, I believe your story is good for one reason only -- to smoke out the doctor who must have approved of such a wild ride.

What is YOUR basis for this assumption??? I have seen nothing that shows this or proves this??  


[ Parent ]
How could (0.00 / 0)
Dr. Baldwin-Johnson do anything to stop Palin from doing what ever the hell she was determined to do?

All she could possibly do is tell her, over the phone, that she shouldn't fly and should go to the hospital.  She was otherwise completely powerless.  It is pretty obvious that Palin does exactly what she wants to.  No Dr. several thousand miles away could stop her.


[ Parent ]
I wouldn't say the doctor was COMPLETELY powerless... (4.00 / 1)
Let's assume that it really is Dr. CB-J and not some other physician.  Let's also assume that she is of the same mindset that seems to pervade the Anch.Daily.News comment pages regarding the Emmonak food/fuel crisis victims -- i.e., if the environment is too harsh and the environment cannot support subsistence fishing/hunting, the natives should move (NOT my belief).

She had the option of taking herself off the case immediately after (assuming the story is true) delivering Sarah Palin of the baby, turning the care of the infant over to a pediatrician and SP's care over to some other physician willing to deal with her.

Ethically, that would have been the wisest thing to do, with an official-letterhead  letter that also advises Sarah Palin to seek psychiatric help.

Barring that, she had the option of refusing to write that letter that the RNC released on Election Eve, which would have forced SP to either not release any medical records as required, or release copies of the pertinent ones instead of a summary letter.

Then, assuming Sarah Palin treats her like every other person who's "crossed" Sarah Palin, and following the example of the not-so-charitable folks who advise moving when the going gets tough, Dr. CB-J could sell her practice and move back down to the lower 48, abandoning her 30+ year practice in Alaska.

It's not like Dr. CB-J didn't have choices.



[ Parent ]
I understand your theory... (0.00 / 0)
and I don't disagree that there isn't "solid" proof of her pregnancy other than a couple of photos, some of which have allegedly been altered in some fashion.

However, my own OB/GYN doesn't buy into the conspiracy theory due to the fact that this person was at a function days after Palin delivered, and overheard the governor commenting on the fact that she needed to go because her milk was leaking. Been there, done that! Breastfeeding a child not your own is possible, but EXTREMELY difficult. My OB also said Palin clearly looked like a woman who had just delivered, and since my OB has been practicing for 20 years, I'll take his/her word any day.

I have lots of pictures of me pregnant, though I did not begin looking obviously pregnant until I was close to 7 months. I attended a meeting around 7 months and a few people afterward were joking that they weren't sure if I had stopped running and was getting pudgy or I was pregnant. My second son was 9# at 37 weeks.

It is not known whether Dr. Baldwin-Johnson advised Palin to seek appropriate medical care in Dallas. Knowing what I know about Palin, I wouldn't doubt she received it but chose to ignore it. What was CBJ going to do several thousand miles away?? A physician makes recommendations but ultimately it's the patient who choses to follow them or ignore them.

You can lead a horse to water......


[ Parent ]
ITA (0.00 / 0)

It reminds me of the picture of Sarah and Piper riding an ATV through a rocky stream with no helmets on either of them.

I gather that they are disinclined to obey speed limits as well.  Or keep their fishing permits up to date.  Or get a building permit for their house.....I guess things like that are just examples of how government gets in the way.


[ Parent ]
The skeptic returns... (3.00 / 1)
I knew the doctors I worked for well enough that if one of them was your OB-Gyn, and I was you, I would have said to them point-blank: 'OK, we know that a non-pregnant woman can lactate and wet-nurse an infant not her own' ((ref: Wikipedia entry 1/3/09) "Milk production can be 'artificially' and intentionally obtained in the absence of pregnancy in the woman. It is not necessary that the woman has ever been pregnant, and she can be well in her post-menopausal period. Women who have never been pregnant are sometimes able to induce enough lactation to breastfeed. This is called 'induced lactation'.") also see"Induced Lactation"  by Barbara Wilson-Clay, BSE, IBCLC (my own reading on the subject causes me to conclude "induced lactation" is brought about by hormonal changes secondary to the suckling action)].

[continuing my conversation with my Ob-Gyn] My question would be, "You said Palin 'clearly looked like' a woman who had just delivered. What, exactly, were the signs that confirmed that for you, seeing her across the room, in the parking lot, what? (choose one or more: Walking stiffly, slowly? Looking bloated, and still distended through the belly area? Edematous? Engorged breasts?)"

There's a picture of SP on 4/10/08 wearing high heels and a 3/4 length skirt; her ankles are very slim, no edema whatsoever.

I'm sorry to be so skeptical, but this is just the same old hearsay "eyewitness" story I've seen repeated over and over again for the past 4 months.  It's like a chain e-mail.  I've heard enough about the staff and administration of Mat-Su Reg. Medical Center to realize this OB-Gyn you mention may be beholden to the church group that's running the facility, perhaps enough to promulgate this story.



[ Parent ]
With all due respect.... (4.00 / 1)
I trust the 20 years of experience of my OB/GYN more than the inexperience of someone like yourself quoting Wikipedia.

Sorry, my OB/GYN is no fan of Palin but DOES NOT believe the conspiracy theory. Period.

Inducing lactation in a non-pregnant woman is extremely difficult and requires the use of risky medication. I firmly believe in lactation but I would never do it without pregnancy. Please re-read your own quote: "Women who have never been pregnant are sometimes able..." that's not very convincing and reads that most are unable. The odds are strongly against anyone successfully inducing lactation. I've known women who have tried, but never succeeded.

Not all pregnant women experience edema, I didn't. Too much edema is a bad thing, and indicates a potential problem. Had you been able to notice "a lot" of edema it is likely she would have been placed on bed rest.

Ironically I've read enough of conspiracy theorists like yourself that are "promulgating" misinformation. You do not have ANY proof that the pregnancy was faked.

I'm sorry that you are incapable of realizing faking a pregnancy is benign compared to what really happened.


[ Parent ]
No need to use belitting adjectives, adverbs, etc.... (4.00 / 1)
Your last comment seems rather testy.   And you've completely ignored my previous comments that indicated I do realize the very thing you mention in your last sentence.  

I quoted Wikipedia AND another site; I always do multiple researches, and I just listed the first 2 in this case.  We're not expert witnesses in a court of law; you have your opinion and I have mine.

And as I mentioned, a lot of your opinion is based on hearsay -- what other people have said Sarah Palin APPEARED to be [pregnant].  In fact, just about EVERYTHING we know about Sarah Palin's "pregnancy" comes from Sarah Palin herself or her very close family and friends.  

Sarah Palin evidently thinks saying a thing is so constitutes proof, from her remarks all these months --  and you deride my opinion because it's NOT backed by "proof".  You seem to be raising the "proof" bar to high-jump height for me, while Sarah Palin is limbo-dancing under her "proof" bar.

You'd think if she really went through the arduous and memorable "wild ride" and really delivered a baby, she'd remember how old that infant is.  Yesterday Sarah Palin in her interview with Glenn Beck said Trig is 8 months old.  Oops, missed it by a whole month!

------------

P.S.  "Ironically"?  I'm still mulling over that term as you used it (def:  Poignantly contrary to what was expected or intended).



[ Parent ]
Why do you care? (4.00 / 1)
Do you live in Alaska? Are you directly impacted by the decisions Palin makes?  

I'm not sure your concern doesn't border on obsession. Why would I have to ask my OB, who has over 20 years of experience, what signs of post-pregnancy were apparent? My OB stated what was obvious, that while in the same room the governor spoke of needing to feed her baby because her breasts were leaking. Sorry, but again I take my OB's word over the word of someone sitting behind a computer in another state.

I was lucky in that I didn't look like I had just had a baby after delivering. Being athletic my entire life it was just a couple of days until I was back into my regular clothes. The only difference was I went up a bra size. I suspect the same of the governor, since she has stated she has been a runner her entire life.

I stand by my ironic statement. I don't have the time, nor do I care, to pick apart your posts. My life is way too busy for that.


[ Parent ]
August 29, 2008 is why I care. (0.00 / 0)
I'd never heard of her before, but when I began researching her background, and in following days heard her stump speeches, she scared me silly.

I never even heard of the pregnancy/non-pregnancy rumors about either her or Bristol until she outed the poor girl at the Convention.  I've concluded Sarah Palin is delusional, and I don't want her getting near the national stage again.

The pregnancy/non-pregnancy question still isn't resolved enough for me to merely sit back and wait for Sarah Palin's ineptitude to implode her political career, so I remain very interested in her day to day attempts to stay in the media spotlight, etc.

If that's obsessed, so be it.

To answer your second question, if you haven't figured it out by now, no, I'm not an Alaska resident (is that pertinent?) but I don't live all that far away.   And your third question, I don't want her to ever have the chance to directly impact me, thank you.



[ Parent ]
I believe I remember an instance (0.00 / 0)
When Trig was not very old of Sarah being either stopped or at the very least recognized driving with him in the car and not in a car seat...now we all know that is totally unsafe and against the law.

So, if a doctor tells her that to fly home in the condition she was in from Texas would be dangerous to the child, not to mention herself..why would we think that would stop her? As I have already said, I really think she didn't mind if the baby didn't make it. I hesitate to say anything stronger than this. You all know what I mean. So far we haven't had any trolls...but I know they do hang in here.



The third theory about Trig (3.00 / 1)
Between the two theories -- (1) Palin faked the pregnancy & Trig is someone else's kid; and (2) the theory so ably discussed in this post -- I am more inclined to believe theory #2.  However, there's a third theory, which I am even more inclined to believe:

(3) Maybe the claim Palin's water broke in Texas was a self-dramatizing lie, which once told publicly (I believe it was her dad, Chuck Heath, who said it first) became increasingly hard to back out of.

Palin has shown herself to be prone to such self-dramatizing lies.  For example, she's given I believe three different & conflicting accounts of when she told her daughters about McCain's request that she be his running mate, each account geared to illustrate something different about her as "unblinking maverick" or "mom who consults her kids before making important decisions", etc.  This would fall right into the same category.

Of course, even with this theory, Palin would have been irresponsible for traveling at such a late stage in a risky pregnancy.  Just not quite so irresponsible as under theory #2.

BTW, for those who think Dr. Baldwin-Johnson should speak out -- seems to me that the doctor is constrained by the bounds of patient/doctor confidentiality.  She cannot give more details about Palin's pregnancy or Trig's birth without Palin's permission.  So give her a break, please, & don't rush to judgment of a person who is ethically prevented from giving her side of the story.

Mel Green
Henkimaa.com


Though I find your theory interesting.... (0.00 / 0)
the problem is this: she was induced at 35 weeks of pregnancy, and it is on record that Trig was 35 weeks at the time of delivery. It is also documented that Trig required phototherapy for a period of time after delivery which also indicated prematurity. Rarely if ever does a term infant require phototherapy. No one just chooses to be induced at 35 weeks. It wouldn't happen, ever. 35-weekers can have problems, and I've seen some that had to be ventilated because of lung immaturity. They can also have poor suck reflexes, which results in poor feeding.

An induction wouldn't have been done for reasons other than there was a problem with the pregnancy or a problem with the fetus. So therefore I don't believe the ruptured membranes claim was a lie, but rather an "oops" moment.

What I think happened was Heath said something that was true and Palin had to find her way out of it. I can imagine that was information that they did not want to get out.

There is no doubt that CBJ has probably been drug in to something she would have rather not been involved. She has an excellent reputation as a family practitioner, and is bound by patient confidentiality. You are correct, Palin would have to authorize CBJ to discuss this situation further which I'm sure won't happen.

I merely put the questions out there that probably would have been asked in a court of law had the patient not been the governor.


[ Parent ]
Thanks for your reply, Lee.... (0.00 / 0)
Is it possible, though, that the ruptured membrane issue happened later than the official story gives it?  E.g., not in Texas before the speech, but later?

If not, then I agree with you that your explanation makes far more sense than the "Trig isn't Palin's son" theory.  Meanwhile, by refusing to provide such a basic proof of who Trig's mother is as a copy of the birth certificate, Palin serves herself in two ways:

(1) The conspiracy theory is kept alive, so that Palin can continue to portray herself as victim of rumor-mongering.

(2) The focus is kept off how extremely reckless she was with the health of her baby.  I agree with you that, if indeed this theory is true, it's a far more devastating proof of Palin's irresponsibility & poor judgment than the "Trig isn't her baby" theory.  Sure throws her right-to-life credentials down the toilet too.

Mel Green
Henkimaa.com


[ Parent ]
Timing of leaking amniotic fluid (0.00 / 0)
I clearly heard Palin's father state that the governor's water had broken in Texas on the evening news the night of Trig's induced delivery.

[ Parent ]
Timing of leaking... (0.00 / 0)
Yes, I'm aware that Palin's father was the first to state publicly that her water had broken in Texas, rather than after returning to Alaska (but, naturally, before the induced delivery).

However, that neither proves nor disproves my theory #3 -- if my theory is in fact correct, he could have been participating, whether knowingly or unknowingly, in Palin's self-dramatizing lie about her dramatic flight from Texas to Alaska.  Or he could even have been the origin of the lie.

That said, I'm not tied to my theory.  I'm more interested in what the actual truth is.  Given that Palin appears unwilling to give us the truth, I'll go for the theory that best explains the facts we know.  At the moment for me it's a toss-up between my theory & Lee's.  I definitely do NOT think that the conspiracy theory that Trig is Bristol's (or someone else's) child best fits the facts.

Meantime, my question still stands: is it possible that Palin's water didn't in fact break until she'd departed Texas, perhaps not even until she arrived in Alaska?

(The fact that she changed to an earlier flight from Texas is new to me, & does tend to weigh towards Lee's theory; on the other hand, I can easily think of other reasons besides her water breaking that might have prompted Palin to depart Texas earlier than originally planned.)

Mel Green
Henkimaa.com


[ Parent ]
"Rarely if ever does a term infant require phototherapy"... (0.00 / 0)
Then why did I find so many references to treatment of hyperbilirubinemia in the term newborn when I researched online?

Here's a sampling from the US, the UK, Canada, and Australia.
--------------------------------
Essentials of Family Practice (Rakel): "The clinical pattern of physiologic jaundice usually manifests as an indirect bilirubin level that rises and falls in the first 3 days of life in a normal term neonate, to a level of about 6-8 mg per dl by 3 days of life, and may peak at "about 12 mg per dl.  Preterm infants may have a peak of about 10-12 mg per dl on the 5th day of life...." http://tinyurl.com/7pq6yn
---------------------------------
Approach to the management of hyperbilirubinemia in term newborn infants: Fetus and Newborn Committee, Canadian Paediatric Society (CPS)... http://www.cps.ca/ENGLISH/stat...
---------------------------------
"...Jaundice is clinically detectable in the newborn when the serum bilirubin levels are greater than 85 micromols per litre. This occurs in approximately 60% of term infants and 80% of preterm infants. Hyperbilirubinaemia is either unconjugated (which is potentially toxic but may be physiological or pathological) or conjugated (not toxic; always pathological). Without treatment, high levels of unconjugated bilirubin may lead to kernicterus." (From Patient*UK)  http://www.patient.co.uk/showd...
----------------------------------
"Approximately 50-60% of term infants will develop physiological jaundice within the first week of life, some of whom will require investigation and treatment...A smaller number of infants may develop unconjugated hyperbilirubinaemia secondary to a pathological cause and these infants more frequently require treatment.  Jaundice in the first 48 hours of life should be considered to be from a pathological cause until proven otherwise." (from The Royal Women's Hospital, Victoria, Australia) http://tinyurl.com/9zubso
-----------------------------------
Guidelines for use of phototherapy in the term infant without hemolysis (Current Pediatric Diagnosis & Treatment: Hay, Hayward, Levin, Sondheimer, 2002) http://tinyurl.com/8w5lyl

I recall what I'd consider a significant number of term newborn infants with a secondary diagnosis of hyperbilirubinemia being discharged from the hospital I used to work at (half a dozen or so out of 30 or so births a month); however, I don't have any firm numbers or any "proof".



[ Parent ]
There is always a question... (4.00 / 1)
in the OB community what defines "term." Some say it's 36 weeks, other say 37, etc. I should have mentioned an infant due at it's due date, but not before. My second son, born at 37 weeks would be considered to some as "preterm."

However, the percentage of infants born on or very near their respective due dates that require phototherapy is small. That was the point I was trying to make, and I should have clarified that.

Clearly there is nothing that will convince you the pregnancy did in fact occur and that is fine. I didn't write the post to convince conspiracy theorists like yourself, I wrote it to those who were unsure, and ultimately with the hopes that someone else will avoid doing as the governor did. I have been involved with several inflight emergencies over the years, unfortunately, and an airplane is no place for a preterm infant to be born.

What is your goal?  


[ Parent ]
To get you to be more precise in your explanations. (0.00 / 0)
But more questions arise, the more you explain:  for instance, was your second son underweight for gestational age, or suffer from some perinatal complication common to preterm infants?  Those who are unsure might be wondering if you meant to explain that further.

I wouldn't even ask a question like that ordinarily, but you brought him into the discussion.



[ Parent ]
KayJay...my daughter was born at 32.5 weeks--4.1 lbs (0.00 / 0)
She required phototherapy.

The place they administer phototherapy is inside the NICU, which is for infants in distress (mainly made up of preemies).  At the time, the doctors and nurses told me that many preemie babies require phototherapy.

I'm not really sure what your point is.


Celtic Diva


[ Parent ]
It's in the title of my post (0.00 / 0)
....@ Tue Jan 20, 2009 at 15:08:08 PM AKST, which is a quote from Lee Thompkins' first sentence in HER post of Tue Jan 20, 2009 at 10:55:39 AM AKST responding to yksin Tue Jan 20, 2009 at 09:21:36 AM AKST.

Specifically, Lee Thompkins said, "...though I find your theory interesting, the problem is this: she was induced at 35 weeks of pregnancy, and it is on record that Trig was 35 weeks at the time of delivery. It is also documented that Trig required phototherapy for a period of time after delivery which also indicated prematurity. Rarely if ever does a term infant require phototherapy. No one just chooses to be induced at 35 weeks."

I was disagreeing with the statement in bold script, because I know from past experience that is not true.  And I found documentation to back up my opinion.  Of course, my experience is merely based on being a keeper of medical records for ~30 years, not being a nurse or an OB-Gyn doctor or being related to one, or having needed the services of one, or...

This has nothing to do with any comments by anybody about preemies needing phototherapy for hyperbilirubinemia.



[ Parent ]
No offense... (0.00 / 0)
...but if Lee says that "rarely" does a full-term child need phototherapy with her experience, I'm going with her.

Everything in my experience says that's true.

And actually, this is a straw-man argument.  The most important point of the post is that THE ACTIONS GOVERNOR SARAH PALIN ACTUALLY ADMITS TO are much more horrific than the conspiracy theory itself.


Celtic Diva


[ Parent ]
One last comment, and then I GIVE UP! (0.00 / 0)
There's apparently no common ground when you claim a request for accuracy is a straw man argument.  

When I pointed out that term infants with hyperbilirubinemia are NOT RARE, I was not setting up a straw man argument, but asking for accuracy.

"A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position." or,  The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position.

Note:  Originally I merely disagreed with Lee Thompkins' entire theory, so I was not misrepresenting any part of her theory.  Nor was I misquoting her.  Nor was I ignoring her "actual position".

And with that, I'll end my "contribution" to this discussion.



[ Parent ]
Occam's razor.... (3.50 / 2)
Lee did a wonderful job presenting this information and I am in total agreement with her conclusions.  There are four significant items in the reported and known history each of which makes the faked pregnancy theory very unlikely and together, almost certainly not true.

1.  As Lee noted, the likelihood that a teenager would give birth to a Down syndrome baby is 25-times less than the likelihood of any one individual 44-year old doing the same.  Taking that by itself and doing the math, that would mean there is a 96.2% chance versus a 3.8% chance, knowing nothing else about Palin and her daughter other than their ages, that the child is Sarah Palin's.  To discount this extremely high probability, you have to assume if a pregnancy was faked, that Trig was mothered by a third unknown party, which is an even more bizarre notion.  That makes little sense given the knowledge that the baby had to have phototherapy, so we would have to additionally presume that the third party's child was born prematurely.  The rationale behind assuming a third party's Down syndrome child as your own could only be subject to conjecture- I suppose one could argue in this case that she might have done this to prove that she walked the walk relative to her anti-abortion stance as a way of becoming a darling to the Evangelical right.  Doing this and having to raise a child like this until the spotlight is off you (and one could argue that Palin hopes and thinks the spotlight will never be off her) would be a degree of psychopathology that I'd like to write a book about.

2.  The report about the Governor's leaking amniotic fluid.  I clearly heard the Governor's father on the evening news say that Palin's water broke in Texas.  If someone were faking a pregnancy, why would that detail be necessary at all?  Someone faking a pregnancy would give as little detail as possible so as not be be entrapped within the lie.

3.  The report about the necessary of induction of labor, which, as Lee suggests,ALWAYSimplies a problem during a pregnancy with a premature child.  The induction was reported in the original April 22 ADN story and this too would be an unnecessary detail in someone trying to pass off someone else's child as their own.

4.  Governor Palin took an earlier flight than planned back from the Governor's conference in Dallas.  This was NOT reported by Lisa Demer in her story, but I discovered this to be the case when I spoke to Lisa, concerned about the literal insanity of the decisions Palin made in flying back to Anchorage with an undiagnosed complication of pregnancy shortly after the story was published.  Lisa didn't think this was important enough to report, but the fact that Palin caught an earlier flight implies that there was some urgency with respect to the Governor's return to Alaska.  That 4-hour change in flight plans necessitated Palin missing part of the conference (I've never seen Palin miss an opportunity to promote herself for 4 minutes much less 4 hours with other Republican governors around).  If there were a fake child that had to be delivered, it would make no sense to have to return earlier.  A child can be passed off as yours at any time.

There is a medical principle called Occam's razor which to simplify it says that all other things being equal, the simplest solution to a series of facts is usually the correct one.  The simplicity here is that Sarah Palin is a narcissist and puts her needs and desires above all others, including her children.  We've seen this over and over again with her respect to the management of the Palin children.  Whereas a concerned parent would not want to put her unwed pregnant daughter in front of the national spotlight for possible ridicule, Sarah Palin was willing to do that.  Whereas a concerned parent would realize that the time spent running for national office or fulfilling the duties of the United States Vice President would take her away from precious time that might be used to help her special needs child, Sarah Palin didn't blink in accepting the opportunity to further her own desires.  And Lee here has presented a compelling fact-based account of someone putting their own desires (not to have a Texan fish-picker)above concern about the safety and health of their own child.  

Palin likely did this by colluding with her longtime friend Dr. Cathy Baldwin-Johnson, who, it is of interest, could not bring herself to give "a medical okay to fly" as reported in the ADN story.  Instead, CBJ was quoted as saying "It was not unreasonable" for the Governor to fly, which is a far different statement than, "It was safe to fly" or "It was wise to fly" or "I advise ALL of my 35-week pregnant patients with a high-risk pregnancy to fly without a hands-on medical evaluation when they're potentially suffering a complication of pregnancy".  I've been around long enough to recognize legalese wording on someone's part.  "It was not unreasonable" could be defended when someone's medical license was at stake with the explanation "this means Sarah had her reasons (it was not unreasonable)to fly; she wanted the baby born in Alaska" but one could add "I never advised her to fly and she did not ask".  The last quotation is an unbelievable one, but likely has enough deniability to save one's medical license.

The debate about whether such personal decisions on any one's part implies inability to govern is an interesting one.  One could argue, perhaps convincingly, that Governor Spitzer's fondness for prostitutes has no bearing on whether he's a good governor in much the same way that some argue that extramarital dalliances which many of our Presidents (Eisenhower, Kennedy, Clinton) have had didn't affect how they governed.  What's going on here, though, I think, is somewhat different.  The contention that I make, is that Sarah Palin has narcissistic personality disorder.  This disorder, of which lack of empathy for others is a key feature, places one's own desires always ahead of anyone else's.  A key feature of those making decisions that will affect both those they agree with and those with whom they disagree should be the ability to put oneself into the shoes of another, to have that empathy.  Over and over again Sarah Palin has shown she is not capable of empathy for even her own children in critical times (teenage pregnancies, flying with ruptured membranes, missing lengthy periods of school).  It would be an incredible mistake for anyone to assume that she was capable of being empathetic and seeing to the needs of others outside her own narrow worldview and only the most narrow of thinkers would support her in being in a position where she could influence others.


Well Said! (0.00 / 0)

I would add that, in my totally unprofessional opinion, she has ADD or ADHD.  Furthermore, I suspect that she may be bipolar.  

I do not feel that mental illness automatically disqualifies someone from office. But if the pathology of the illness is integrated into the person's behavior as a public servant, the ability of the person to serve may be questionable.  Palin is, in my opinion,  not fit to serve Alaska let alone the USA.  She is a sick kitty.


[ Parent ]
I still think (3.00 / 1)
Lee has laid out the most well thought out idea of any I have seen. No matter the theories behind all the pictures of how they may be "doctored" or "faked". No one has yet proven they are. Yes, I have read all the stuff on the web site from "Audrey" not because I necessarily believe it but just because I find it fascinating how people's minds work.

Lee has spent time and effort working all this out, that is obvious. She has made a very well reasoned argument to say the least as to what has happened, and I find it much more believable than any "fake" pregnancy theory.

I have always had my doubts about that...and still maintain as I did in my earlier post, that SP was trying her best to self abort, by doing everything she could in risky behaviour.

She continues doing things that put her children at risk, including dragging them all over the country, in every kind of weather, to all kinds of functions, out of school, with no regard to their safety, education, health or well being. And that is from the eldest to the youngest.

That alone tells me the story Lee has presented is probably more true than we will ever know.  






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